This episode’s question comes from Phillip Jones, from Two Degrees Group, who asks, “In a world with no, or little trust, in brands (we see through you) … how do you market?”
This episode is the fifth in an eight-part series answering listener questions. For each episode and question, an amazing marketer from my network will join us and provide some different points of view and advice.
In this episode, David Pembroke, Founder and CEO of contentgroup, an agency who have long been experts in content marketing, joins us to answer Phillip’s question.
You can connect with David at contentgroup.com.au or on LinkedIn.
Enjoy.
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
As part of the service, I have had this episode transcribed. Transcribing, proofing, and editing a podcast episode is A LOT of work. That’s why I use a service called REV who provide professional freelance transcriptionists who are vetted for quality. While they offer a 99% accuracy guarantee, I do not proof-read their work extensively. Instead, I simply copy and paste below and, as such, please note that this is not a verbatim transcript of the episode and I have trimmed things like the intro, close, and mid-show ad.
Daniel
David, welcome to the show. You and I have known each other for a long time now. And I remember we first met when it was back in the days when content marketing was… it was really just starting to be spoken about as something that businesses should be looking at. And so I felt like I’d met some motto of the kindred spirit in you. And back then you had founded Content Group and it was only small, but it’s many years on now. What does the business look like right now? And where do you focus in terms of work?
David
Yes, Daniel. Well, thank you very much for that. And I do remember very well when we met when indeed content marketing world had its one and only venture offshore when it came to Australia all those years ago. And you’re right. We founded Content Group way back in 1997. And my insight back then sort of came out of my background which was in corporate marketing. I’ve worked for Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing, an American multinational. And done a marketing degree in the early ’80s at the University of New South Wales. But then had followed my dream to be a journalist for the ABC, and put together the skills after 10 years at the ABC thinking, “Well, I’ve got journalism skills, I’ve got marketing skills.” And one day in the future, there is a promise that we would all carry supercomputers in our pockets and we’d all be able to create video content, audio content.
So I thought way back in 1997 that that was something that we might be able to do. And so fast forward the tape to 2021, really the game hasn’t changed much. We’re still in the business of helping our clients tell their stories so that they can achieve their business objectives. It’s as simple as that, no more complicated than that. And our focus at Content Group is very much in the public sector. So our mission at Content Group is to help government and the public sector strengthen communities and improve the wellbeing of citizens through effective communication. And that’s what we try to do every day here at Content Group.
Daniel
Great summary. Now, Dave, as I said in the intro, Phillip Jones from Two Degrees group, better known around our hometown of Canberra as the Martini Whisperer, he has submitted a listener question for this mini series. And Phil asks, “In a world with no or little trust in brands,” and then in brackets, he’s written, “What you see through you… How do you mark it?” Now, it sounds like he’s asking that question both as a business and a brand himself, but also with this consumer hat on. So the question is essentially, in a world with no or little trust in brands, how do you mark it? Now, the main part of Phil’s question is about how to build trust and as a content marketer yourself. That’s why I picked you and invited you on the show to come and help answer these questions for Phillip, it feels perfectly teed up for you, Dave. So if a brand came to you and asked, “Dave, how can we build trust with our market?” what would you tell them?
David
Well, I think you’ve got to start with the single most important element. And that’s really understanding who it is that you are seeking to engage with in order for you to achieve those business objectives. So it would be about understanding who those people are, what their needs are, what their problems are, what their issues are, what their opportunities are, and spending as much time as you possibly can understanding their needs. And then working as hard as you possibly can to create value for those particular customers, and to be consistent in that delivery of value to that customer over time. Because I think it’s only that you can build trust by being consistent, by being authentic and by being real. And so it is about delivering value. It’s about having impact. And the only way you can do that is over time.
So to answer Phil’s question, trust is a factor of doing what you say you’re going to do and doing it over and over again, not letting people down, not disappointing people, and delighting people with either the product or the service that you are trying to deliver to that particular target audience, and be as authentic and as real as you possibly can.
Daniel
David, a lot of my listeners are small and medium businesses. That’s who the show is pitched at. All of that content marketing approach you just spoke about probably sounds great to the listeners that makes sense. Let’s understand them, what are their needs? How do we add value? But they may also be thinking, “Geez, that sounds like a lot of work on top of an already busy schedule.” If so, where would you advise people to start and focus, mostly in terms of tactics, if they want to kick off some content marketing? So if they’ve spent time understanding their target audience and their needs, and maybe how they can add value, are there tactics that small or medium businesses can… maybe some low hanging fruit, are blogs a great way to go? Is it social media? Is it podcasts? Where would you advise them to sort of focus first off?
David
Well, it’s a great question, Daniel. And the answer is it depends. And what it depends on is that research that people have done. And research doesn’t have to necessarily mean, “Okay, I’ve got to sit down and write a 30-page survey and I’ve got to distribute it to hundreds of different people.” It can be simple things about taking the time to have a conversation with perhaps one of your best customers, and going and having a cup of coffee and asking those questions about how can I add value? How do you consume content? What do you prefer? What are the best ways for me to be able to reach through to you? Who influences you and how in fact can I engage with them? So again, research is not, as I say, just… you don’t have to think about it as big set pieces. It can be as simple as those sort of daily conversations that you’re having.
One of the things that we do here at Content Group in all of our projects is to go back whenever they finish and test. The team who did the work doesn’t go out and do the evaluation, but another member of our team does. Because what we want to know is we want to know the good, we want to know the bad, we want to know the ugly, we want to know the great, we want to know all of it, because what that helps you to do is to improve. But better your question around that content marketing side of things, really the first, second, third, fourth and fifth most important thing is the audience and understanding them as best as you possibly can. And in a crazy busy time when everyone is so put upon by so many demands, not just in their private lives but in their work lives as well, and as we’ve gone through such a massive change, not only ourselves but in all of our customers who are suffering from this major displacement that’s happened through COVID-19.
I think what you’ve got to try to do is to pick a channel and whether it is an email newsletter, I think I’d probably start with that as something that can help you to build a relationship with an audience over time by creating value. Maybe hit for that email newsletter. And it might be just once a quarter, you don’t have to sort of come out of the gates and try to do something on a weekly basis or a fortnightly basis or a monthly basis.
But if you do decide that it’s going to be on, let’s say it’s a quarterly basis, make sure that you turn up on a quarterly basis. You consider how busy everybody is. It’s like booking an appointment with your client to be able to say, or with your audience group and saying, “Hey, here I am. This is the information that we have for you that we think is going to be of value to you. Here we are turning up on the first day of the month, at the beginning of the quarter. And we’ll be back in three months time with the next installment of value that we were seeking to create for you.”
Social media, I’m less sort of convinced that it’s a great conversion channel. I think people are re-evaluating, again, post COVID, having a look at social media and where it works for them. The gold standard, I think, is that permission-based marketing where someone says, “Yeah, okay. I want to give you my information. I want to give you my email address.” And then from there, you can really start to hopefully build out an audience over time. And once you build that audience, you can then start to understand them a better and create more value as you go.
Daniel
I love that appointment analogy, Dave. Now I wanted to pick up on part of Phil’s question that he put in brackets, where he said we see through you to the brands, employing that as consumers we can see through brand’s poor attempts at trying to engage and build trust with us. What is some advice to brands around how to be authentic and ensure that they are relevant, but not just relevant but relevant at the right times?
Phil’s point is a good one in that we now have access to the world’s information at our fingertips 24 hours a day, seven days a week. We can check you out. We can understand you. We can do our background checks. I think IBM have got statistics that say 80% of a buying decision is taken well before anyone bothers to turn up, either submitting a form on your website or picking up a phone call and getting to you. So building trust, being authentic is be who you are, but understand who you are, what you stand for, where you can create value for a particular segment. And be true to that and be consistent in that. I think that we are now going into a very narrow cast era. And I think you’re better off particularly when you’re picking a segment or a niche is to pick one and stick with it. Don’t try to be all things to all people, because it’s too hard, it’s too big, it’s too complex.
David
So again, when you’re doing that research, when you’re talking to the clients that you’ve got, when you’re talking to perhaps new clients who you may want to get, listen to them, listen to what they’re saying to you, and understand how it is that you can add value, and then turn up consistently over time to create value for that audience. That’s the only advice that I can give for people is don’t be a phony, because as what Phil says is exactly right. People will see through that. And it’s very hard to be a fake over time, particularly if you’re publishing content, to be anything other than who you are. There’s only one of you, so just be you and stick to you and just get good at being able to solve people’s problems in that niche, in that segment that you’re looking for. And I think that’s how you’ll build that trust and confidence and assurance with that audience over time.
Daniel
So, Dave, what is your favorite way to market to people? Now, I’m going to hazard a guess. I’m going to guess it’s content marketing, but tell us why.
David
My favorite way of marketing to people is through the creation and distribution of useful, relevant, consistent multimedia content. That works for me. It draws that back on my background as a journalist and the skills of my team, where they’ve come from, television background production, radio background production. And they’re journalists, they’re content creators. And so that’s what works for us. And it’s great to see when you’re translating a story into that most appropriate asset, and then being able to turn up and create value for people. As part of that content marketing, my favorite part of content marketing is podcasting. Again, my background was in radio journalism with ABC Radio, Current Affairs and ABC Sport. And so I spent a lot of time behind the microphone and I enjoy it. I enjoy speaking to people. And again, much like you, Daniel, I enjoy creating content that creates value for my audience. And so we work in the government and public sector space. So every week on the GovComms podcast, we’re looking to create value for that audience through the sharing of stories from people who are working in government communications and public sector communications around the world.
So I love the podcast because I love the intimacy. I love the relationships that you can create with your audience. And I love engaging with smart people, because whenever you do a podcast, you always learn so much from the guests that you have on. So that’s why I like that as my preferred form of content marketing.
Daniel
Oh, I completely agree. Listening to other people and experts and people working in various industries, you always learn something when you’re hosting a podcast. So David, how do people find the podcast? It’s Content Group’s podcast. You’re the host. It’s called GovComms. Tell the listeners a little bit more about it and maybe why they should give it a listen if they work in government comms.
David
The simple way to do it, it’s registered on all of the various podcatchers, whether it’s Apple, Spotify, Stitcher, Acast, you’ll be able to find it wherever. And if you do Google, because we are closing in on 300 episodes, so we’ve been at it for a long time, Google GovComms, it’ll come up. And take your pick, there’s lots and lots of episodes there. And you can go back through the catalog and fill your boots.
Daniel
Now, David, if Phillip or anyone else wants to get in contact with you and continue this chat, what can they do? Where can they go?
David
Either an email at david.pembroke@contentgroup.com.au or LinkedIn, that’s the easiest way, and again, just that David Pembroke. Come to me and I’d love to have a chat with anyone who is interested in having a conversation. And if you are in gov comms and you would love to come on the podcast, let me know, and we can make a time. We’ll sit down and have a chat.
Daniel
Outstanding. David Pembroke, founder and CEO of Content Group, thank you so much for joining us and sharing your expertise and advice and entering Phillip’s listener question about brands building trust.
David
Thanks very much for having me on.